Who picks up the tab if it's the wrong revision?

Discussion in 'Design, Development and Standards Discussions' started by Marc LeClair, Oct 29, 2008.

  1. Marc LeClair

    Marc LeClair Frequent Poster

    Many of the bid documents I receive state that the tower must be designed to the most current version of TIA/EIA 222. Granted, if the bid went in today Rev F would be applicable, but after the first of the year Rev G would be in effect. However, if the city?s building official says they?ll only accept Rev F, who should pick up the tab for the redesign?
  2. Wireless Estimator

    Wireless Estimator Administrator Staff Member

    You could easily subscribe to the point of view that the client should pay for any inherent redesign and structure costs since Revision G would be the most current version. The client, however, will assuredly disagree, citing that the ?current version? is the version that the local jurisdiction abides by. Attorneys will take opposing views as well. Perhaps the best answer is to perform additional due diligence prior to submitting your bid and see if you can get clarification in an addendum prior to your submission.
  3. Marcello Posada

    Marcello Posada Friend of the Community

    I will be more concerned if it was the other way around. If a tower or monopole is designed for revision G, it is sure to pass revision F, since G is a lot more stringent than F.

    I, like Marc, have been getting a lot of requests stating that the pole must be designed for the most current revision of the TIA. My response to that is to find out if the pole, tower or site will be purchased this year and built this year, then revision F of the TIA will apply. If the tower will be built during next year then I will most likely use the revision G for design criteria.

    However, I do have a question that has been bugging me for quite a while, what happens to towers or poles that are bought in the present year but don't get delivered until next year? If the client does not specify what revision should we use to design and build the pole, what do we do? What design criteria do we use?
  4. Simon Weisman

    Simon Weisman Industry Observer

    Basically, the purchaser specifies the standard; the building authority approves the construction plans and issues permits; and the courts decide which person is responsible for the negligence or incompetence that led to the failure or losses suffered by one party or another.

    The rest of us must conduct ourselves accordingly.

    If you give the purchaser what he asks for, but you believe that the design is inadequate or will otherwise prove unacceptable or unsatisfactory, the least you can do is have a document signed by the client in which he acknowledges your having informed him of the situation, his having understood it, and his taking on any consequential liability.

    Make sure your lawyer is involved in the preparation of any such document. Also, you had better be very poor when the stuff hits the fan.

    As to who pays, the purchaser is the only one bringing money to the table, the other parties - fabricators, installers, and consultants - bring only materials and skills. That's the deal!

    The purchaser pays one way or another.
  5. Mike  Plahovinsak

    Mike Plahovinsak Friend of the Community

    Come January 1, the engineer has the responsibility to use the more stringent of the two revisions (Rev-G).

    Saving a few bucks initially to get a lighter structure design will not be worth losing a carrier when building department officials get wise to the fundamental differences between Rev-F & Rev-G.
  6. Simon Weisman

    Simon Weisman Industry Observer

    With currently, available software the checking of the design for both standards should not be a major undertaking and is well worth doing.

    For example, GUYMAST-G will read files prepared for the F version of GUYMAST. The few additional items to be entered will take very little time.

    The major work in preparing data for analysis is the pulling together of all the information. This should not be a big deal in the case of design, because the designer must have all data at hand already.
  7. J. Tinsley

    J. Tinsley Industry Observer

    I haven't noticed Rev G as more "stringent" or producing drastically heavier towers than Rev F. If Rev G is applied with standard defaults it does produce a slightly heavier structure than F but it's minor, G affects taller structures more drastically over 200', and more so on poles. Rev G can produce a lighter structure than F depending on how the category variables are applied. Rev G just added the ability to make an adjustment depending on the site specific situation, more flexibility.

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